Please Help! All the barriers and rings I've tried dissolve after a few hours!!!

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flux
Posts: 25
Joined: 2016-12-07 21:13:52

Please Help! All the barriers and rings I've tried dissolve after a few hours!!!

Post by flux »

Are there any rings out there for those with ileostomies ???
It seems they are all made for those with colostomy, because they are all made out of a dissoluble material (hydrocolliod), that dissolves by the end of the day, and exposes the skin to the output. I have to put on a new bag 1-2 times per day.

I have tried 5 of the major brands of bags, and they all dissolve in less than 6 hours.
At least this gave me a chance to figure out which closure I like, but I still have the problem of having to change it every day, which is making my skin VERY unhappy (and my bank account very empty).

So the solution seems to be to find a ring that does not dissolve, like the hollister/Eakin/Coloplast/etc ones do. I don't know what moron thought it was a good idea to make the barrier dissoluble... the bag isn't dissoluble, so they should do the same with the barrier and make it out of foam, or rubber, or gel, or plastic, or silicone, etc.

So what ring out there can I use????

The only one I found so far is Siltac, but it doesn't stay stuck to the skin, and so the output goes under it.
I tried using washers from the hardware store, and then sticking them to the skin with Urobond III but it burns the skin horribly, and tried using Talbot latex cement, but it doesn't hold the two together, and so just lets the output pass right under the appliance.

So in summary, the solution I (and I'm sure thousands of others) need is a very thin (so it flexes and moves with the skin) ring that does not dissolve, and then an adhesive that sticks to skin and does not dissolve by simply touching output. (We are in the modern age for goodness sake, there are literally hundreds of adhesives out there that are water proof, fire proof, acid proof, gasoline proof, oil proof, shatter proof, etc. I'm sure there are plenty that can hold up fine to a little human waste.)
Last edited by flux on 2017-03-22 20:00:39, edited 3 times in total.
doreejill61
Posts: 205
Joined: 2016-01-27 11:05:54

Re: Please Help! Are there any rings that last more than a day?

Post by doreejill61 »

One of the major companies makes a ring that is half the thickness. I remember it came in one of my freebies.
flux
Posts: 25
Joined: 2016-12-07 21:13:52

Re: Please Help! Are there any rings that last more than a day?

Post by flux »

Please, does anyone out there know what I can use??
My skin is burning ALL the time.
Hydrocolloid ones dissolve after a couple hours.
smashms
Posts: 1455
Joined: 2010-10-23 23:18:12

Re: Please Help! Are there any rings that last more than a day?

Post by smashms »

i use the hollister ones on an illeal conduit which is urine. mine lasts 3-4 days. what is your application like meaning how do you apply it? what procedure do you follow? sometimes you just have to go back to basics when your changing so often. are you using any soaps with moisturizers in it? not letting surface dry before putting appliance on and such.
neurogenic bladder and T6 paraplegic ileal conduit 2/15/2011
To Good Health
Posts: 1972
Joined: 2009-12-22 07:36:28

Re: Please Help! Are there any rings that last more than a day?

Post by To Good Health »

Welcome to the group, Flux. I share your disappointment with flanges that dissolve with output. I have a colostomy which behaves like an ileostomy because it is from the transverse colon. Have you tried Convaec Durahesive? I think it's called Active something. I would like to use it as the flange is more durable but it doesn't come in a big enough size for my 2inch+ stoma. I Use the Convatec Active Stomahesive which dissolves away in 2 or 3 days. Call Convatec and talk to their people who have experience in finding solutions and are more than willing to send you samples. Sorry you are having such a rough time. Also, do you have an enterstomal therapy nurse? All the best,
TGH
Chemo/rad Mar 07
APR/ileo May 07
Perm colostomy 2009
Perforated colon Nov 2013
To Good Health
Posts: 1972
Joined: 2009-12-22 07:36:28

Re: Please Help! Are there any rings that last more than a day?

Post by To Good Health »

Flux, in some places enterstomal therapy nurses are known as WOCN (wound ostomy care nurse). Mine works from the hospital but sees outpatients as well. Good luck,
TGH
Chemo/rad Mar 07
APR/ileo May 07
Perm colostomy 2009
Perforated colon Nov 2013
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steiconi
Posts: 1114
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Re: Please Help! Are there any rings that last more than a day?

Post by steiconi »

Are you talking about rings, like Ekins and Hollister make, or are you saying the wafers dissolve that quickly for you?

Experimentation might help:
-- after you remove a leaky wafer, rinse it off and look to see where the leak occurred. Mine usually leak at a skin crease, so I use a little extra ring to fill the crease before applying the wafer. Perhaps you could use more ring in the area that persistently leaks--like, spread ring over the entire wafer in that area.
--have you tried using the wafer WITHOUT the extra ring? Maybe the wafer adhesive will stick better for you.
--perhaps using less ring would work better for you; I use only 1/4 of a ring, make it into a snake, and flatten it on the wafer. Lots of people use 1/2 a ring.
--After applying the wafer with or without the ring, use a tube-shaped item to press the wafer against your skin. Some use a bit of plastic pipe, others use TP cores. Find something bigger than your stoma, but smaller than the tupper part of your wafer. I use it after attaching the pouch, so don't have to worry about ooopsies.
--for your irritated skin, do you use a barrier wipe or spray like Cavilon?
--if you ARE using a barrier, perhaps try going without, to see if it is affecting adhesion.
--there's a recent discussion thread here on UOAA about non-adhesive systems. They use a non-dissolving silicone ring held in place by pressure from a belt. I'm not sure if they work with ileos, you might check it out.
--speaking of belts, maybe using one of those wide belts that put pressure all around the wafer might help.
--whew!
Lee

I am not my disease.
flux
Posts: 25
Joined: 2016-12-07 21:13:52

Re: Please Help! Are there any rings that last more than a day?

Post by flux »

Hello All, and thanks for assisting with this!!!
ok, to answer your questions..

The issue is not getting the wafer/ring to stick to the skin, that part is fine.

I have spoken with and tried the wafers and the rings of the major companies (Coloplast, Hollister, Convatec, Cymed, etc), but they are all made out of the same material, and so they all dissolve after a few hours of contact with the ileostomy output, which then exposes the skin to the output. I need to find a company that was bright enough to make a ring out of a material that does not dissolve, and has adhesive to stick it to the skin. (or just tell me an adhesive... so far I've tried Talbot latex cement, Urobond III, and a couple others)

I'm turning to this board for help finding it. Thanks!
To Good Health
Posts: 1972
Joined: 2009-12-22 07:36:28

Re: Please Help! Are there any rings that last more than a day?

Post by To Good Health »

Flux, I believe the durahesive wafer is made of a different material than the stomahesive wafer, although both from Convatec (Active Life).

Lee, thanks for the mention of the non-dissolving silicone ring. I'll check out that thread.
TGH
Chemo/rad Mar 07
APR/ileo May 07
Perm colostomy 2009
Perforated colon Nov 2013
flux
Posts: 25
Joined: 2016-12-07 21:13:52

Re: Please Help! Are there any rings that last more than a day?

Post by flux »

Does ANYONE know of a ring that's not Hydrocolliod? (so it doesn't dissolve after a few hours)
Or, an adhesive I can use to glue this silicone ring I found to my skin?
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steiconi
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Re: Please Help! Are there any rings that last more than a day?

Post by steiconi »

I'll ask again: have you tried using just the wafer, without the ring?
if the ring is your problem, stop using it. It's not mandatory.
Lee

I am not my disease.
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susan f
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Joined: 2005-10-01 21:26:14

Re: Please Help! Are there any rings that last more than a day?

Post by susan f »

flux,

I highly recommend seeing an ET nurse to assess your particular situation. They can help.

Many of us use the products you are describing successfully; I have been using Eakin's seal for 12 years. I put it under my Assura Extended Wear wafer, directly on the skin, and then place the wafer on top of it. I have gotten between 2 and 5 days with this (shorter duration time more recently as a result of adhesions and active Crohn's Disease).

Is the hole you are cutting in the wafer the right size? It should come up to the stoma, but not lay on top of it. If you are cutting it too big, then no strip paste, barrier ring or anything else is going to help if it is directly exposed to output.

Is it a one piece or two piece? I have had zero luck with one pieces, they seem to turn into wet washrags in a day, where the same material in a two piece works just fine.

Is your skin clean and dry when you put on the appliance, if it is raw, are you using powder and paste to "crust" the skin and help it heal? Are you using anything with moisturizers or oils when you clean the skin? I know you are saying that sticking isn't a problem, but it is hard to tell what the problem could be without seeing. Again this is where the ET nurse can help.

Hydrocolloids don't work for me either, I have had the most success with the Assura Extra Extended (two piece) and Eakin's seal.
UC Diagnosis 1981
J-Pouch 1988-2002
Permanent ileostomy 2002-now
Crohn's Disease Diagnosis - 2015
jstl
Posts: 170
Joined: 2009-12-01 21:07:28

Re: Please Help! Are there any rings that last more than a day?

Post by jstl »

For what it's worth, I don't use any rings- I had the same problem you describe. Instead, I use an old-school method: karaya paste. I place just a thin layer around the stoma (touching the edge),then place a Durahesive wafer (the flexible kind, with paper edging) and I'm usually good to go for 5-7 days. The paste protects the skin and (in my opinion) helps it heal. It probably would sting a little if the skin were excoriated.Maybe a WOCN could give you a sample.
Murph00
Posts: 175
Joined: 2014-01-24 14:16:12

Re: Please Help! Are there any rings that last more than a day?

Post by Murph00 »

Hey Flux,

I have a Colostomy so I may be off base here but I tend to agree with Lee. Try using the wafer without a ring or paste. If an adhesive will help your situation, I recommend using the Hollister 7730 medical adhesive. This stuff has been a game changer for me. I haven't used rings or paste since finding it. Although I do still use a skin barrier wipe.
Sparingly spray it on your wafer, spread it around with your finger, let it dry three or four minutes and apply. It should help immensely and extend the life of your pouch considerably.

Good Luck,
Murph
Testicular Ca 2007
IV Colorectal Ca 2011
Colostomy 2011
Irrigation 2014
Lung resection x2 2012,17
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RonMc
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Re: Please Help! Are there any rings that last more than a day?

Post by RonMc »

I have short bowel syndrome, lots of liquid output. I use the Coloplast two piece system. I use their paste on the base ring. I dampen my finger and push the adhesive flat against the ring all the way around. I then put the base on. I run my finger around the stoma to make sure the opening is settled tight against my skin. I then use the Brava strips around on top of the base plastic adhesive. Snap on the bag and lock it. I then tug all the way round to make sure the bag is truly locked. Then I again run my finger around the stoma one more time. I go a week, shower frequently and have very little skin irritation.

I believe the paste actually fills in the little wrinkles and bumps around the stoma. By moistening it slightly and pressing it into the base plate I ensure that the paste is not just sitting on top of the base but is sealed in to it. Again, I have high output and frequent output and this works for me really well. Also the Brava strips allows me to shower frequently, a problem I was having with every other product I tried coming up after a short period of time.

Best wishes and Merry Christmas
Colorectal Cancer 2006
Too many issues in between to mention
Permanent Ileostomy 2012
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